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joliet_jane
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 18, 2008 2:28 pm
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McDonis wrote:
If you look at the screenshots I believe tarot and the themes behind tarot are more than just minor in this game. Granted we only have limited info and perhaps the screenshots arent representative...

However it appears to me this is a MAJOR departure from the style of games made previously. I know someone (I believe Jen) said I should have more faith in Aaron and Chris since the previous games came from mormon country and the games reflected it. Even Aaron came out and commented saying its not a Tarot game. Well so far I see occult symbols, wegie board, tarot cards, and a general theme that centers around that world. Perhaps its not a tarot card game but tarot and the occult seem to be major themes.

I love Aaron and Chris but frankly right now I cant see anyway I would buy such a product...

I really hope this isnt the direction the intend to take from here out... Or that the images and info currently released isnt at all representative of this game.
Good. Gravy.
Are you also not allowed to read Harry Potter? Or dance? Or wear zippers?

So go ahead. Have it your way. Miss out on an awesome game. :|

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Bafitis
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 18, 2008 3:25 pm
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McDonis wrote:
Bafitis wrote:
lestat666 wrote:
I am definately keeping an open mind about the tarot thing.


The game isn't going to revolve around the Tarot cards, so you don't have to worry about that...

I think this will be an excellent game... And as long as we are able to get the word out and get enough people to buy it, then AC and CJ should be on their way back to the Fedora...



If you look at the screenshots I believe tarot and the themes behind tarot are more than just minor in this game. Granted we only have limited info and perhaps the screenshots arent representative...

However it appears to me this is a MAJOR departure from the style of games made previously. I know someone (I believe Jen) said I should have more faith in Aaron and Chris since the previous games came from mormon country and the games reflected it. Even Aaron came out and commented saying its not a Tarot game. Well so far I see occult symbols, wegie board, tarot cards, and a general theme that centers around that world. Perhaps its not a tarot card game but tarot and the occult seem to be major themes.

I love Aaron and Chris but frankly right now I cant see anyway I would buy such a product...

I really hope this isnt the direction the intend to take from here out... Or that the images and info currently released isnt at all representative of this game.


Others raised the same questions to Aaron in one of these threads and he was quick to debunk that line of thinking... The Tarot Cards will play a part in the game, but not like you might think just because of the title...


Below you can read Aaron's Original Post on the Matter...

This is the Thread from which AC's post came from if you want to review the entire thread...
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1883

AC wrote:
Hello from Aaron & Chris!

It's good to see the (mostly) positive response to our teaser for TCM! We're as excited as anyone about the upcoming game and we look forward to sharing more information and, eventually, a more detailed trailer and an interactive demo. These will be available sometime soon on our new website (http://www.threecardstomidnight.com).

I know people have a lot of questions and, though we're not ready to divulge everything, I'll be happy to provide a few more details. So, if you have questions, post them here and I'll put together a list of FAQs and answers later this week.

One big question that's already come up is about the role of Tarot and Tarot cards in the game. In Three Cards to Midnight, the Tarot cards are not used in the traditional sense (i.e. fortune telling); they are used to represent people and places important to the story and are not part of the actual gameplay.

We want to make clear that is not a Tarot-reading sim or a virtual Ouija board. The story isn't centered around the Tarot. The cards are used for their intriguing symbolism and unique visual appeal.

In addition to answering FAQs this week, we hope everyone will try to tune in to Blog Talk Radio at http://www.alternativereel.com next Monday night. The podcast will be available after, but you can call in during the live show and hopefully we'll get a chance to chat with you! Check the topic for more information.

Thanks again for all your interest and support!

Aaron

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McDonis
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 7:05 am
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Like I mentioned in my post I do remember Aaron saying that. He was replying to my earlier post. The problem is (for me anyway) that all the screenshots and info shown so far indicate the opposite of what he is saying. It appears they are going down that path, if they want to make a game like that its ok with me. I understand others might like a game with that kind of content and subject matter. My main fear is this would be the pathway a new Tex game would go down too. Especially with some of the imagery done in the radio theather of past lives and such.




As to toilet jane:

No I dont allow content like Harry Potter in my home. As for dancing and zippers believe it or not but folks can have convictions and have fun too.

Normally when a game series does something like this I move on since its only a game. But with Tex its something more, I miss the kind of games we had 10 years ago. Losing Tex to that kind of similar content would be a blow. If you cant respect that then please just dont bother commenting.

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joliet_jane
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 9:09 am
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McDonis wrote:
As to toilet jane:

My reply to you, McPenis...
McDonis wrote:
No I dont allow content like Harry Potter in my home.
I knew it.
Fiction. AKA "made up." AKA "not real." What part of this can't be understood? Of course, I would think that, being a librarian and all.
And I don't even like HP-- it's lame and derivative.
McDonis wrote:
Normally when a game series does something like this I move on since its only a game. But with Tex its something more, I miss the kind of games we had 10 years ago.
There's a wide range of content on on the shelves. And games with questionable morals have been around for a long time. By the way, the new game is not a Tex game.
McDonis wrote:
Losing Tex to that kind of similar content would be a blow.
Only if you choose to make it so.
McDonis wrote:
If you cant respect that then please just dont bother commenting.
I frigging will if I want to.

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lotus_j
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 1:49 pm
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McDonis wrote:
Like I mentioned in my post I do remember Aaron saying that. He was replying to my earlier post. The problem is (for me anyway) that all the screenshots and info shown so far indicate the opposite of what he is saying. It appears they are going down that path, if they want to make a game like that its ok with me. I understand others might like a game with that kind of content and subject matter. My main fear is this would be the pathway a new Tex game would go down too. Especially with some of the imagery done in the radio theather of past lives and such.




As to toilet jane:

No I dont allow content like Harry Potter in my home. As for dancing and zippers believe it or not but folks can have convictions and have fun too.

Normally when a game series does something like this I move on since its only a game. But with Tex its something more, I miss the kind of games we had 10 years ago. Losing Tex to that kind of similar content would be a blow. If you cant respect that then please just dont bother commenting.


Have you ever played a Tex Murphy game before? Martian Memorandum was about an all powerful mystical object from MARS. UAKM was about a prophecy and a magical occult statue. PD was about UFOs.

I'm sure the Tarot Cards are part of the game in some sense, just as the prophecy/occult were part of the Tex games. They will not be a major part.

It's obvious from the screen shots that one character has some occult ties and that is about it. That's all we can gleam from the screen shots. If AC says that the game doesn't revolve around it all then I'm sure he knows better than you.

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Bafitis
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 4:28 pm
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joliet_jane wrote:
My reply to you, McPenis...

What is the meaning of this offensive behavior and attack on McDonis??? It's a simple discussion, McDonis is clearly allowed to have an opinion like the rest of us, no need for offensive name calling...


McDonis wrote:
Normally when a game series does something like this I move on since its only a game. But with Tex its something more, I miss the kind of games we had 10 years ago. Losing Tex to that kind of similar content would be a blow. If you cant respect that then please just dont bother commenting.


I have to agree, there was more to Tex than just another Sci-Fi game... Though I do like Sci-Fi myself, I see what you are saying here... The Tex Series was able to pull people into it's world... Every time I play UAKM and Tex gets jumped after finding the Statuette, I can almost feel the blows when he is getting his ass kicked... I almost always have a mild headache after that scene...
And Pandora, after playing that for awhile, I always feel like there are Agents of some kind watching me, I look for Black Sedans in traffic and stuff... They just have a way of pulling you into the game and making you a part of it...

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Jen
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 5:06 pm
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Jane is only doing what I would do. You diss Aaron or Chris, we open a can of whoop-ass on you.

Your post... The problem is (for me anyway) that all the screenshots and info shown so far indicate the opposite of what he is saying.You doubt his word, I get a little spastic.


That's all I'm sayin.

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Bafitis
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 5:27 pm
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I can see what you're saying, I just don't think the obscenity of the comment was called for, that's all I'm saying...



It's a new game that we've gotten limited information on so far {not that I expect them to spoil it or anything} and I can see how McDonis would think that the game seems to revolve around the Tarot aspect... We'll just have to wait for the Demo to give us a better perspective of the way the game is going to play out...

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lotus_j
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 7:16 pm
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Bafitis wrote:
I can see what you're saying, I just don't think the obscenity of the comment was called for, that's all I'm saying...



It's a new game that we've gotten limited information on so far {not that I expect them to spoil it or anything} and I can see how McDonis would think that the game seems to revolve around the Tarot aspect... We'll just have to wait for the Demo to give us a better perspective of the way the game is going to play out...


Well he did call her "toilet," jane. Was that called for?

So you can see how McDonis doesn't take the word of the game's designer?

Interesting. Me, I'm going to believe the game's designer that the game doesn't include playing tarot, etc. or glorify the occult. The occult just happen to be in the game some, and that isn't different from say, Tex Murphy games...

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Bafitis
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 7:34 pm
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lotus_j wrote:
Well he did call her "toilet," jane. Was that called for?

McDonis wrote:
As to toilet jane:

Such a minor adjustment to the name, I did over look that...
No, I'd have to say that, that is uncalled for as well...

Arguing/Discussing is one thing, but having to resign to name calling, it just seems so Elementary School to me...


I'm not saying that I don't believe Aaron's word about the game, I'm just saying from the limited Screenshots and small video clip that we've been given, I can see how someone could have doubting thoughts...

We hear critics talk bad about movies all the time, but do we always believe them and NOT see the movie??? And then we hear the Actors and Directors rave about the movie... Do we believe either??? No, we go and see the movie and decide for ourselves...
Games are no different... The people who make them and the people who review them go and say they are off the hook and out of this world, but once we play them we find that the game Sucked and we wished we hadn't spent the money on them...

The point of arguing over this, Just because it is Aaron and Chris who are making it, is pointless... Some of us are going to love the game, some of us are going to hate it, some of us are going to just like it... Most of us will give it a try, mostly because of who it is that is creating it, but you can't ensure everyone will love the game...

We can't force the game down people's throats just because of who is creating it... If a person doesn't like the information, screenshots, video clips, or demo, then you can't force that person to purchase the game... And that is all that McDonis has stated so far... Once the Demo is released and McDonis gives it a try, he is likely to change his mind or confirm his first thoughts of the game...

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lotus_j
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 21, 2008 7:42 pm
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No one is talking about forcing it down anyone's throats. Also no one is implying the game will be good just because CJ and AC are making it.

We are implying it doesn't REVOLVE around Tarot or glorify the occult. Like the game designer said.

That is entirely different than liking something or being based on an opinion.

UAKM is about a CULT that believes in genetic purity that worships a big jade bird! As long as they have the bird they can win!

However the game really revolves around murders, deception, thefts, and a plan to poison the world from space. It is up to Tex to stop it. Tex doesn't use any "magic," or anything to do the job.

The trailer for UAKM could get people to believe all kinds of things.

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McDonis
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 22, 2008 5:14 am
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lotus_j wrote:
Bafitis wrote:
I can see what you're saying, I just don't think the obscenity of the comment was called for, that's all I'm saying...



It's a new game that we've gotten limited information on so far {not that I expect them to spoil it or anything} and I can see how McDonis would think that the game seems to revolve around the Tarot aspect... We'll just have to wait for the Demo to give us a better perspective of the way the game is going to play out...


Well he did call her "toilet," jane. Was that called for?

So you can see how McDonis doesn't take the word of the game's designer?

Interesting. Me, I'm going to believe the game's designer that the game doesn't include playing tarot, etc. or glorify the occult. The occult just happen to be in the game some, and that isn't different from say, Tex Murphy games...


Actually that wasnt intentional... That really was a typo on my part, for some reason that was what I thought their handle was. I apologize for that, I wasnt trying to throw a dig at them.


Considering that I accidently messed up their name I wont take what they said seriously.


I dont think its attacking Aaron or Chris to be worried or concerned about their next project. Last time I checked Aaron and Chris werent running a religion where we had to worship them. I respect their achievements and would really like to enjoy a new project from them. But I think its natural and more than acceptable to wonder\question this project. Aaron says that its not a tarot game, yet every screenshot seems to indicate its more than just backstory. It seems much more central to this story than say what the Dove was in UKAM. Which I was willing to let slide since (as already pointed out) both the occult and magic in that game are really only references and not more than a quick backstory. Basicly a way to make our enemy's appear more evil not actually experiencing that world or simulating it.


I am more than willing to give Aaron and Chris the benefit of the doubt. Quite frankly if it wasnt them I wouldnt be bothering to have this conversation or even talking about it. I would simply avoid it just from the screenshots alone. But since it somes from them and I respect their work so much I can GUARANTEE I will be giving the demo a run and reading all I can about the game. And even IF this game is what I fear it might be (a game I cant play on moral grounds) it doesnt mean I think poorly of them or wont give their next game a shot.


I would like to also say its troubling to me personally that we cant have an adult conversation about the game. Why is it forbidden to raise concerns or discuss the game? Is only love and adoration allowed here? Part of what I like about Tex games is the fact that its more of a thinking persons game. Its not about action\guns\women without tops its more about story and content and humor. Yes there is action but is limited and its more about plot advancement rather than only there for the quick hit. Thus I find it curious that we cant raise concerns or question things. Granted I didnt help things by messing up the users name. But several times now I have seen this kind of behavior. How do you expect to grow as a community when the only talk you will premit is your own point of view?

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lotus_j
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 22, 2008 2:49 pm
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It's not forbidden to raise concerns. It's just stupid to question the word of the game designer. They should know what is in a game. You're letting your irrational fears JUDGE something you haven't even played yet. That is kind of silly.

You can defend your absurd actions all you want, but you're not acting very adult like. You immediately question the quality of the community just because you want to JUDGE something without any evidence but there IS evidence to support you acting irrationally.

What is more believable the guy who wrote the game stating the occult is not a major player or some guy who has 6 screen shots from a game saying it does?

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Bafitis
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 22, 2008 3:02 pm
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lotus_j wrote:
It's not forbidden to raise concerns. It's just stupid to question the word of the game designer. They should know what is in a game. You're letting your irrational fears JUDGE something you haven't even played yet. That is kind of silly.


It's only really stupid, because this community knows the Designers on a personal level... For the most part designers will tell the public what they want to hear so they can push people to purchase their product... I've read reviews and comments by designers before saying that their game wasn't a "Shoot 'Em Up" type of game it has this story that your character goes through and whatnot, come to find out when I played it, it was nothing more than a "Shoot 'Em Up" style game... Next to no story... You had a guy tell you what to do, when you did it, he explained in about 3 sentences why you had to do it and then told you what to do for the next mission and so on... No character interaction, no multiple endings, no personal life matters, no type of possible love interest, nothing... But the Designer and reviewers told people what they wanted to hear so that the game would get purchased...

The fact that it is Aaron and Chris we are talking about, we can take their word at face value... But it's only human nature to "Assume" things, even when you've already been given factual information...
You're planning a Cookout, News Weather says it's going to be 74 Sunny, but they also show you this little weather system to the north... So you start thinking, "I hope it doesn't Rain tomorrow"... You've been given Factual information, no chance of rain, 74 Sunny light breeze from the Northwest... But you are hoping that it doesn't rain on your BBQ...

Game Designer has said that the game doesn't really involve the Tarot Cards, But in the Screenshots and the Trailer there has been quite a bit of Tarot Cards being shown and referenced... Only natural to raise questions...

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Frank
Post subject: Re: Three Cards To Midnight - Teaser Trailer
Post Posted: Oct 22, 2008 4:53 pm
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My interpretation of this is that the tarot cards are just a clever system to structure the game and introduce playable flashback sequences.

We don't seem to have the same understanding of morals so I'm not sure where your line is drawn or exactly what it means, but I personally don't see this being any different than the mystical and the occult in the previous games being tools to structure and introduce the story.

I never realised this was sensible matter enough to prevent from approaching it. I'm rather curious to understand the chain of thoughts behind this rationale but for the sake of good spirit and general camaraderie I'll refrain myself from further questioning.

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